Federal Judge Orders Bayview Park Cross To Come Down

June 20, 2017

A federal judge has ruled that a cross in Pensacola’s Bayview Park violates the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment to the United States Constitution and must be removed within 30 days.

“I am aware that there is a lot of support in Pensacola to keep the cross as is, and I understand and I understand and respect that point of view,” U.S. District Judge Roger Vinson wrote in his ruling. “But, the law is the law.”

The Freedom from Religion Foundation and the American Humanist Association filed suit against the City of Pensacola over the cross in 201 on behalf of four citizens. the judge ordered that the city pay the plaintiffs a total of a $1 in damages, or 25 cents each if evenly divided.

Bayview Park is a 28-acre city park in the East Hill neighborhood, overloking Bayou Texar. A wooded cross was erected there for an Easter Sunrise Service in 1941. In 1969, the Pensacola Jaycees replaced the wood cross with a concrete one for dedication at the 29th annual Easter Sunrise Service. The concrete cross, which still stands and is the subject of this dispute, is a 34-foot white “Latin cross.” A Latin cross consists of a vertical bar and a shorter, horizontal one. It is a widely recognized symbol of Christianity.

“We are pleased that the Court struck down this Cross as violative of the First Amendment,” said Monica Miller, Senior Counsel at the Appignani Humanist Legal Center. “The cross was totally unavoidable to park patrons, and to have citizens foot the bill for such a religious symbol is both unfair and unconstitutional.”

It costs the City of Pensacola $233 per year — out of a $772,206 annual maintenance budget, or about .03% — to keep it clean, painted, and illuminated at night.

“The Bayview Cross is part of the rich history of Pensacola and of Bayview Park in particular. Thousands upon thousands of people have attended services in the park over the years. It has also been the site of remembrance services on Veteran’s Day and Memorial Day, during which flowers were placed at the foot of the cross in honor of loved ones overseas and in memory of those who sacrificed their lives for our country,” Vinson wrote in his ruling.

It..”has hosted tens of thousands of people, and has stood on public property in one form or another for approximately 75 years (apparently without incident), four people—Amanda Kondrat’yev; Andreiy Kondrat’yev; David Suhor; and Andre Ryland—contend they are “offended” by it and want it removed,” Vinson wrote. Amanda and Andreiy Kondrat’yev have since moved to Canada.

“The historical record indicates that the Founding Fathers did not intend for the Establishment Clause to ban crosses and religious symbols from public property,” he wrote. “Indeed, ‘the enlightened patriots who framed our constitution’…would have most likely found this lawsuit absurd. And if I were deciding this case on a blank slate, I would agree and grant the plaintiffs no relief. But, alas, that is not what we have here,” the judge wrote.

Vinson did offer possible solutions to the city:

“To be clear: None of this is to say that the cross would have to come down if the City sold or leased the area surrounding it to a private party or non-governmental entity (so long as the transfer was bona fide and not a subterfuge). Nor would there be a constitutional problem with worshipers using a temporary cross for their services in the park (counsel for plaintiffs conceded that point during the hearing).”

“Count me among those who hope the Supreme Court will one day revisit and reconsider its Establishment Clause jurisprudence, but my duty is to enforce the law as it now stands,” Vinson concluded his 23 page ruling.

Comments

81 Responses to “Federal Judge Orders Bayview Park Cross To Come Down”

  1. Catherine Whitmore on June 26th, 2017 5:21 am

    Next thing you know, if not going on already…someone will try to take down the historic cross on Pensacola Beach. There is no end to the absurdity going on…signs of the times..nature of the Beast. If you are a Christian, you know what I mean….meet me at the “Cross”…Tuesday 6/27 from 5-7 p.m.

  2. MYPHRONTISTERY on June 25th, 2017 1:29 am

    It is simple no matter the cost their is a separation of church and state. Everyone thinks the church is being attacked but if I’m correct and I usually am religion is protected under the Constitution. So what’s the big deal people who do not want to see religious symbols in public places has that right. All the religious people can go to church on Sunday and worship, PERIOD.

  3. Chris in Molino on June 24th, 2017 8:01 pm

    @kane–You need a serious brush-up on history. Not the diluted version from school. Learn about the people who came here. Your right about America not being a Christian nation. New anymore anyway. Now everyone and their granny are here. Anyone born after 1980 has been programmed to accept this new America which has become a big pile of …. Love the Muslims, conservatives are terrorists, peter puffers and gender benders are your friend. Its insane. It wasn’t so long ago that no judge in his right mind would’ve made such a decision. Oh yea, that’s when America was a nation of Christians. Now God is gone from America (by design). Sorry to say but EVERY Anglo country on earth is being done this way. Europeans weren’t as gullible as Americans to the plan so its recently been forced on them. As much as people won’t acknowledge it (much less admit it), assimilation, muti-culturalism, and diversity, are just code for anti white. Oh well, the thin social fabric left in this nation is soon to fall apart. I can’t wait. Then you love everyone socialist yuppie liberals will cling to me for food and shelter begging protection from my bad ol firearms because the government you helped create will not be your friend. The people you care for so much will be the same ones killing, beating, raping, and looting your neighbors. And you’ll wish you lived in America (the Christian version).

  4. Taco on June 24th, 2017 6:04 pm

    Kinda funny that many folks are ranting about their tax dollars paying for something they don’t support…….. kinda like how all of us have to pay for Obammy care and we didn’t want or need it!

  5. Scott Miller on June 24th, 2017 3:58 pm

    Judge Vinson’s order specifically said

    “To be clear: None of this is to say that the cross would have to come down if the City sold or leased the area surrounding it to a private party or non-governmental entity”

    That being the case, our organization is going to to lease it from the city, in compliance with the judges order and be done with it.

    If leasing was a problem, they would have to tear down every church on Pensacola Beach because it is all leased from Escambia County.

  6. kane on June 23rd, 2017 4:32 pm

    It is on public land and should be moved to a privately owned lot. If all of you “offended” “Christians” would like to donate to keep this cross up on a privately owned lot then you should take up a collection and do so. America is NOT a “Christian” country we are a country of many many many religions and all of them want to be respected not just yours. Our government should NOT foot the bill for your faith because the government has to represent EVERYONE that lives in this country. Unless of course you would also like to see a pentagram sharing space with the cross and menorah?

  7. David on June 23rd, 2017 6:06 am

    As I said, the cross will stay and legally…first step taking place now. It will be free legal representation and on solid legal historical precedent . It is already law and it was overlooked locally
    Thank you

  8. David Huie Green on June 22nd, 2017 11:33 pm

    REGARDING:
    “It’s really sad that a symbol of the very reason this country exists today is going to be removed.”

    The reason the country exists today is because the people of the colonies rejected the concept of the divine right of kings to rule over their subjects. They rejected the clear teachings of the Bible when they did so. Jamestown was formed by people trying to get rich. The Pilgrims did not come for religious freedom, they already had that in the Netherlands. They came to sidestep the problem given in First Corinthians 5
    9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
    10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.

    They came to North America to get out of the world, go to a New World, because, even though the had total religious freedom in the Netherlands, they had sinful neighbors so they came here where there are no sinners — or so they figured.

    Others came here because England wanted to get rid of criminals or to clear Scottish land of humans so they could raise more sheep, or to avoid punishment from crimes before they were caught, or to get to less crowded places, to be free to live as they wanted. Some came because their neighbors could get rum for them and they sold them to other people in North America who wanted slaves.

    When they formed a new nation, they were not shooting for religious purposes other than Christian freedom, free to be or not be whatever kind of believer or non-believer they wanted.

    The cross in question here does not establish a religion, but we should never think the people who came here wanted a particular religion to rule their lives, especially not Catholic since they tended to be quite intolerant and burn people at the stake…as did the Puritans.

    David for truth and The Truth

  9. Don Neese on June 22nd, 2017 11:01 pm

    1 Corinthians 1:18 KJV
    For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

    Galatians 6:14 KJV
    But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world..

  10. Brian on June 22nd, 2017 2:42 pm

    Rest assured that those responsible for taking the Cross down will one day have to answer to the Ultimate Judge.

  11. Simmer Down on June 22nd, 2017 2:39 pm

    Tired of lawsuits? Stop violating the Constitution.

    Tired of symbols that represent freedom from oppression? I simply don’t understand where you’re coming from, but I think you’re letting your true colors show.

    If the land is sold to a Christian organization so the cross can stay up then the city will have to sell to any outfit that wants to put up a pentagram or other such symbol.

    Anne1 of 2: Don’t get mad, get even. How very Old Testament of you. People are used to Christians dropping their “Christian attitude” whenever it suits them to do so. Hypocrisy is practically expected. Also, when do you plan to construct your balloon memorial? What day? It would be another useless gesture. Instead of spending money to help hungry people you could spend it on balloons. It isn’t about the good deeds you do, it’s about people seeing you do good deeds. Right?

    Peace!

  12. david lamb on June 22nd, 2017 1:23 pm

    All these politically corrects that want to take down confederate symbols/ statutes and religious symbols are far from right. Note that they want to erect and leave MLK and their important symbols that are just as annoying to ME!

  13. anne 1of2 on June 22nd, 2017 11:40 am

    Robert has the right idea, private property does have it’s perks! Let’s all take balloons with crosses on them down to the site of that cross and build this huge memorial to it also. Don’t get mad, just get even. Not a great Christian attitude, I know, but I am tired of these stupid lawsuits.The judges must cringe at the sight of them.

  14. tim on June 22nd, 2017 10:27 am

    Hope your right David, it should be easy to do!

  15. David on June 22nd, 2017 8:01 am

    The cross will stay…watch how it happens.It will be legal

  16. JC on June 22nd, 2017 2:20 am

    hey Gary… they are at the foot of that cross…..

    :-)

  17. Bubba on June 21st, 2017 7:50 pm

    Just quitclaim a small patch to a local church. Now it’s private property

  18. Denny on June 21st, 2017 6:17 pm

    Our European forebearers came to this land to get away from a government telling them what religious beliefs and practices to have. You are free to erect a cross or any religious symbol on your own property. Our founding “fathers” ensured that no religious symbols belong on public lands used and supported by Americans of all religions.

    Judge Vinson merely upheld the U.S. Constitution. If you don’t believe in American constitutional principles, then seek a country with a theocratic government that matches your beliefs.

    Amen!

  19. Stinker on June 21st, 2017 6:16 pm

    So you don’t like the establishment clause? Okay, let’s say an Islamic logo, thirty feet tall was placed at this park by some group and then your tax money had to pay for its maintenance. It’s clear to most people that tax payer money should not be used to support religion, it’s a sure path to a theocracy or fascism. Our Constitution protects individual liberties, not the PR interests of religious organizations.

  20. Valient Thor on June 21st, 2017 5:22 pm

    Glad to see Judge Vinson following the letter of the law.

    You are free to worship as you please, in any religion that you choose, but do not expect for religious monuments and/or places of worship to be subsidized by taxpayer dollars.

    Your religious freedoms remain intact.

  21. Duke of Wawbeek on June 21st, 2017 4:41 pm

    A simple solution would be to place a Menorah alongside the cross.

  22. Burnie D. Silcox on June 21st, 2017 2:08 pm

    Give or lease Cross & area to one of our local Native Tribes Perdido Bay Clan, or Santa Rosa Creek Indian Tribe. It is history that Christ was brought to new world,Right here in Pensacola..in 1559. This makes it history, not religion.We will keep up.This I promise…Mvto & Merretv….Thank you & Be Blessed. Think on this Mr. Mayor…..

  23. Gary on June 21st, 2017 2:02 pm

    Where are the rights of Christians?

  24. Casual Observer on June 21st, 2017 12:42 pm

    Ironic….when Judge Vinson went against President Obama and his push for “Obama Care,” he was hail fellow, well met, nationwide. Now he is following a principle established by a higher court, and some citizens want to hang him out to dry. He has studied the case law and knows how to handle this situation, without it developing into a money pit only profitable to plaintiffs and attorneys. He did offer future choices, and made a fair and informed decision.

    Also Ironic….we have a few people who are among the “perpetually oppressed citizens of America,” who demand that all citizens be tolerant, respectful, and accept their own social, sexual, religious, and historical views. But these same people are highly hypocritical of the common folk that do not agree with their “generous” opinion.

  25. Concerned Christian on June 21st, 2017 12:41 pm

    When I was a child in Sunday School, I can remember being taught
    That there would come a day when our religious freedoms would be taken
    away from us but I didn’t think much about it then. My friends we are there !!

  26. Spankz on June 21st, 2017 12:12 pm

    How about one of the local rich do-gooders who really care about the people of Pensacola, buy the property from the City and boom, problem solved.

  27. Simmer Down on June 21st, 2017 11:56 am

    Diane,

    Atheists walk among you unnoticed. They don’t yell at your car while you’re waiting at a stoplight.

    Where do you see chaos being spread by atheists? The Middle East? London? The Pulse night club? These are not acts that can be attributed to atheists.

    It is not the chaotic atheists that violate the constitution. If the atheists were losing the lawsuits then you could blame them. The atheists are winning. Decisively. But you’re right about laminating the lawsuit. I’m sure it will be needed again. Some judge will put the 10 Commandments back in a courtroom, again, and get smacked down, again.

    Peace!

  28. Frank on June 21st, 2017 11:34 am

    Shouldn’t be an issue for Christians. The cross is a pagean symbol by origin and if you do some researches you will find out that Jesus didn’t die on a cross. Only couple hundreds years later after Jesus died , pagean symbols and traditions were mixed into “Christianity” by Emperor Constantine and others (same with the Trinity and other beliefs).

  29. Diane on June 21st, 2017 10:33 am

    I have no problem with atheists displaying the symbol that represents their religion in the park. OOPs my mistake. They have none to represent their beliefs. They just believe in spreading chaos wherever they land. Perhaps they could put a laminated lawsuit on a post somewhere. Once again a small chaotic minority has helped the taxpayers spend their money on a lawsuit.

  30. william smith on June 21st, 2017 8:40 am

    I cant believe that each day we wake,some ingrate can take another piece of history
    and structure that we as Americans value. The kid asked his friend why didnt God stop the shooting in the school? His friend replied, God isnt allowed in school any more!
    When will we stand and put a stop to this?
    What happen to us?

  31. Chris in Molino on June 21st, 2017 8:18 am

    @Simmer down— What power ? Get the constitution changed, yea right ! The only way its going to get changed is to take away more freedoms for more government control over its slaves or to make society more weird sick and perverted. Look at the constitutional amendment to define marriage. They never thought that many would vote in that manner given the mind control of media. So when the people did vote against the sickness they said oh no, screw the people, what they want is unconstitutional. So please, try some dummy.

  32. CW on June 21st, 2017 6:55 am

    I bet of you took a survey of Pensacola residents under 35, much less than half would consider themselves religious, so I’m not sure who this “majority” is that people here keep ranting about. Most of the commenters here probably don’t even live within the city limits.

  33. Xpeecee on June 20th, 2017 9:31 pm

    William, it would be very nice, if you could give each comment an option for people to like or dislike…… And I Agree with Betty H. :)

  34. Linda Parslow on June 20th, 2017 8:51 pm

    Hurry up and donate the land to a private company and the cross can stay. Do this immediately before they have time to tear it down. I am sure you can get fees for maintenance.

  35. Charlene Ward on June 20th, 2017 8:51 pm

    This is absolutely ridiculous. Looks like we need to get rid of a judge and those that have issues with this cross need to get out of this area. The world is really going to hell quickly and some of you cross haters will be the first to go!! Shame on you!!!

  36. Tim on June 20th, 2017 7:36 pm

    If enough citizens will build crosses and replace them everytime one is taken down those leftist whiney babies would understand that the majority of the people are tired of being inconvenienced by the titty babie millennial snowflakes. I am so tired of this crap it makes me want to scream. But until we start standing up to them it will only get worse

  37. Jim on June 20th, 2017 7:30 pm

    It so sad that Christians spend so little time with their god that they need imposing public displays to remind them of its existence.

  38. Jim on June 20th, 2017 7:26 pm

    If you want to keep the cross up on public land, then place a speaker on the cross so that the Muslims can conduct their daily call to prayer.

  39. Charlie on June 20th, 2017 7:01 pm

    Absolutely Absurd!!
    Two people out of thousands say they are offended!

  40. EMD on June 20th, 2017 5:53 pm

    The minority RULES again.

  41. Robert on June 20th, 2017 4:12 pm

    This makes me very sad. The simple fact that 4 intolerant people can do this. Move it to private land, May be , we should start a drive for that, give what you can. Or as a very wise person just told me. For every one we lose, lets put our Crosses in our own yards, instead of looking at one, they will now have to look at hundreds! Makes sense to me, how about you? Well , that is what I am going to do. GOD BLESS YOU ALL! We live in uncertain times.

  42. Mark on June 20th, 2017 3:49 pm

    These are sad times in America, when we are letting the hateful rule over us. There is only 1 reason someone would not like a cross.

  43. Craig Reynolds on June 20th, 2017 3:47 pm

    “Can I sit at a picnic table at the park and say grace for my food, or will I offend someone in the park? I’ll bring my own cross.” Simple answer – Yes. That’s your choice. The municipality, or any governmental agency, cannot choose for you. Nor in matters of religion, can they promote or command one set of religious opinions or practices over another. The presence of this cross on public land, maintained and illuminated with public tax money, represents the promotion of a religious opinion by a government entity. You may continue, however, to promote your personal religious opinion by performing whatever devotional exercise you wish, saying your prayers or crossing yourself or counting rosary beads, perhaps in the place where the cross once stood.

  44. Charlie on June 20th, 2017 3:12 pm

    If the land the cross is on can’t be purchased or leased, then maybe the top portion above the horizontal cross bar could be removed, or the cross bar portion removed. I think that people would still understand the meaning, but it could then officially & legally be not considered a Christian cross. Just one legal way to play the PC game. Loving that the judge who unfortunately had to follow present law, “awarded” the plaintiffs a grand sum of one dollar.

  45. Betty H on June 20th, 2017 3:04 pm

    It’s really sad that a symbol of the very reason this country exists today is going to be removed. It’s not the cross that is the problem..it’s people wanting to destroy all links to our nations history and founding father ideals.

  46. Alabamian on June 20th, 2017 2:58 pm

    Holy crap, get over it people. If there was a big image of the Koran in that place you’d be going bonkers. It’s a public, government-funded place and religious symbols of any kind have no business there.

    And have any of you taken a minute to realize that you’re behaving just as butthurt and offended as the ones wanting it taken down? It goes both ways! If you want to look at a cross, go to one of the thousands of churches (that don’t pay any taxes) in the county. Nobody is telling you that you can’t practice your religion you buncha babies.

  47. Simmer Down on June 20th, 2017 2:48 pm

    The arguments made here against this action are incredibly dim and entirely predictable.

    If it offends you, don’t look at it. Please. It is a public park. Its maintenance is paid for by all taxpayers. Not all taxpayers are Christians. Is it fair to compel someone to pay to support a symbol of another person’s religion? No. It is not fair.

    The city should sell the land so we can keep the cross. Can you not foresee what will happen? If the city sells that bit of land to a group of Christians then it would have to sell land to any group that wants to buy a piece. Otherwise the city would be favoring one religion, which the 1st Amendment has been interpreted to prohibit. If someone wanted to erect a monument to Baubo the religious right would have an aneurysm.

    Nobody is trying to destroy anyone’s faith. Drop the drama.

    You complain about the liberal atheist morons but you don’t really do anything about it. You’re getting trounced by morons. How embarrassing for you. If you want to have the government pay for your religious symbols get off your backside and get the constitution changed. It won’t be as easy as sitting there whining, but Christians are a huge (and not so silent) majority. Use that power.

    Peace!

  48. Dan on June 20th, 2017 2:28 pm

    All you people saying “people that don’t like it should just turn away”, would you be willing to just “turn away” if a gigantic Satanic symbol was in its place? How about the Islamic crescent? Somehow I doubt the tone would be the same. There’s a lot more than 4 of us Atheists here, only 4 involved with the litigation. Just bc something has stood for many decades does not make it right or legal(the same was once stated about slavery and interracial marriage). The Establishment clause is clear as numerous Federal courts have confirmed over the years including the SOCUS. Just bc you don’t understand the Establishment clause doesn’t mean it’s been misinterpreted or applied incorrectly. The plaintiffs don’t have a problem with the cross itself, only that it is on land owned by the city/state/govt. The plaintiffs clearly tried to get the city to move it to private land. Just bc the majority of the populace here is of the Christian faith also does not make it right or legal.. In case you haven’t noticed that’s not how Democracy works. No one is taking away anyone’s religion or access to your preferred faith, simply keep it where it belongs, out of the government sphere.

  49. Shake Your Foundations on June 20th, 2017 2:07 pm

    if you don’t care about the historic monuments and crosses being take down across the country don’t worry; it’s just a matter of of time before the Left
    gets around to banning something important to you…Freedom OF religion; NOT freedom FROM religion.

  50. At The Cross on June 20th, 2017 1:21 pm

    Think about this:
    Matthew 24
    3 And as he sat upon the Mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately*, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?….
    …9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name’s sake.
    10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.

  51. Thoughts on June 20th, 2017 1:12 pm

    I hope the Cross stays there and those two on the lawsuit have been making trouble for a while disrupting the County Commission Meetings with Satanic Prayer Invocations. I suppose this could go to the Supreme Court but after a lot of thought I also see a bright light in this:

    The USA does separate church and state for Freedom of Religion, not necessarily Freedom from Religion. But look up THEOCRACY (where a government is one with a religion) That my friends is dangerous to our way of life.

    Atheists, liberals and alt rights and moderates in USA have more in common then one may think.

    Think if ISLAM or a North Korean type regime tried to take root. we would not want our government to dictate those religious tenants. ISLAM is not JUST a religion. Their tenants, their sacred texts, the Qur’an unlike preaching the “good news” like Christianity.–Their sacred texts preach world domination and advocate deceit,(Taqiyya) killing infidels (any non Muslim) to make the whole world bow to ALLAH and SHARIA LAW.

    Perhaps the cross “having this attention” serves to shine a light on another more dangerous Jihad than just an assault on Judeo Christian belief.

    This knowledge that Islam is not just another religion but that it is a political system needs to be acknowledge by the courts. Similar rulings to separate religion and government need to be adhered to be in the favor of the USA democracy. Hence the vetting of dangerous political systems infiltrating the USA.

    Perhaps the humanists are unwittingly causing a revival of Christians, a new tolerance of other beliefs and an awakening to the dangers that threaten our freedom and way of life.

    This Bayview Cross is still a symbol of hope and light no matter where it is.

  52. anne 1of2 on June 20th, 2017 11:50 am

    So, can I sit at a picnic table at the park and say grace for my food, or will I offend someone in the park? I’ll bring my own cross.

  53. CW on June 20th, 2017 10:53 am

    Aren’t there enough crosses at the thousands of churches in this area? Does there really need to be one in a park? There are many religions in this world, why should Christianity get special treatment?

  54. Spudder on June 20th, 2017 10:47 am

    I think with all the comments said we all should get together and protest .
    So let’s all get together and go
    This judge will be judged by the old mighty himself
    Amen

  55. Linda on June 20th, 2017 10:37 am

    How much would it cost to buy or lease the land from the city?

  56. Xpeecee on June 20th, 2017 10:12 am

    It will take an “Event” to change the direction of this country. As long as the “Silent Majority” remains silent, this trend will continue. The classic war of good vs evil is evident. Currently, immoral Liberals are winning… :(

  57. fred on June 20th, 2017 9:57 am

    Friends, history is filled with destruction of churches and icons, murder of Christians and attempts by pagans and enemies of God to wipe away our faith. The result has always been that these offenses strengthen our resolve and move us to reaffirm our faith. These people and their accomplices in the courtrooms will never eliminate our faith, nor will they erode our commitment. This is not what the Founding Fathers intended in the Establishment Clause, but people like this have shopped around and found complicit judges to help them stretch the interpretation to suit them. No one has established a state religion, nor has anyone coerced them to attend any kind of church or worship. But, they make it their business to be perpetually offended. They may remove the Cross from Bayview, but they will never remove it from our hearts and minds.

  58. Dana on June 20th, 2017 9:41 am

    I think it’s rather hypocritical that people say “if the cross offends you, turn your head and look away”. So if gay marriage offends you, look away!

    While this cross does not bother me at all, I’m beyond ready for an actual separation of church and state.

  59. East Hill Patron on June 20th, 2017 9:36 am

    I think it is terrible that 3 or 4 people 2 of which are not even here anymore could cause this iconic cross to be taking down. I I am 60 years old and have been going to that park since I was 13. I t is ridiculous that someone wants to take down such a beautiful thing. The sunrise services at the cross were beautiful. To think it has to come down is ridiculous.

  60. Rodney Cammauf on June 20th, 2017 9:34 am

    Why can’t a group or church come together and either purchase or lease the plot of land the cross stands on from the city. The judge made it clear that if that happens the cross can stay.

  61. Fed up on June 20th, 2017 9:25 am

    Someone needs to file an appeal and slow down the process

  62. molino jim on June 20th, 2017 9:22 am

    Judge Vinson only did what he had to do. There have been other courts and judges who have had to follow the rulings of the higher courts. This has been an on going fight for a number of years.It is not all way about the Cross. There was a member of the military who was killed in combat who he and his family beleived in Wicca. the family wanted to have the Wiccan symbol on his grave marker and were refused. The wife fought up the court system and was allowed to have his grave marker showing a Wiccan sign on the stone. I would be very willing to help pay for the cross to be moved or to buy the property if the city would sell it. I’m old enough to remember when certain religions would only allow members of their church to be buried in their graveyards. I did like that the judge gave them only one dollar to be split — i guess that shows they are all four just “two bit ******s”

  63. Fed up on June 20th, 2017 9:22 am

    Judge Vinson and Mrs. Miller will pay for this one

  64. East Hill Patron on June 20th, 2017 9:17 am

    I think it is terrible that because 3 or 4 people can cause something like this. I am 60 years old and been going to that park since I was 13 years old and always thought that was the cross was a beautiful especially the sunrise services. This is absolutely ridiculous.

  65. getoverit on June 20th, 2017 9:07 am

    The people who fought this are perpetually offended and cannot stand the sight of Christianity, anywhere. Just look them up. I’m glad two of the 4 went to Canada. Good riddance. The other 2 can follow suit. I’m sure there’s no Crosses in North Korea. Anyway, since Judge Vinson caved to this non-sense, I think the quickest and most easy solution is to just lease the land it sits on (or sell it) to a private entity, quickly. I don’t think the mayor would have a problem with that based on his reactions so far. This is one of the few times he seems to have it right. Also I think it would be pretty neat if all the surrounding neighbors erected crosses (if they want to). How cool would that be…ban our public cross…get 20-30 in response on private land. BAM.

  66. scott on June 20th, 2017 9:01 am

    From the tone of these comments, the law does not matter. If we form that frame-of-mind, where does it lead and leave us?

  67. God on June 20th, 2017 8:59 am

    Majority rule is not how the Constitution works. This isn’t an election. The Constitution was written to protect the minority from the tyranny of the majority.

  68. 429SCJ on June 20th, 2017 8:35 am

    Christ is a great reminder to some peoples, of their great crimes against Christians and the cross is Christ symbol.

  69. Peter on June 20th, 2017 8:15 am

    Is there NO way to stop the removal of the cross? This is ridiculous. If the cross offends someone, let them turn their heads and not look at it. Whatever happened to the MAJORITY rule?

  70. Chris in Molino on June 20th, 2017 8:03 am

    This is the mentality of liberal, socialist, atheist morons. If a conservative doesn’t like a cross, he doesn’t go to the place that cross is. If a liberal doesn’t like a cross, he wants crosses banned. Sad our once little country town has brought these people here. But hey, some people love the “progress” we’ve made.

  71. molino jim on June 20th, 2017 7:38 am

    I for one feel there would be no problem in getting the money to buy or lease the small area where the cross is. The question would be if the city would follow up on the sale.

  72. SW on June 20th, 2017 7:37 am

    Once again, imagined law by unelected men who wear robes.

  73. clint on June 20th, 2017 7:25 am

    Just another victory for the Devil. When God is taken away, watch out!!

  74. randy on June 20th, 2017 6:37 am

    What about my rights. ? I like the cross .. KING roger is a bum

  75. Lou on June 20th, 2017 6:25 am

    This is an example of what has gone wrong with our country! This is a test to see how strong our city is. Another judge that can’t wait to defend “the law” and turn his back on the majority. This is sad…..it the cross offends you…don’t look at it! Time to stand up for what is right!

  76. Anne on June 20th, 2017 6:05 am

    Time for church leaders to come together and find a mutually agreeable place for this cross to be forever a marker of not only religion but also the Unity of the Christian community in our area.

  77. David on June 20th, 2017 5:57 am

    Mans law…….always aborts common sense and unity. Mans politics…..no one won anything but made us smaller

  78. Praying on June 20th, 2017 5:35 am

    NO LAW should be above our Lord and Savior!!! Ridiculous

  79. Resident on June 20th, 2017 5:14 am

    2 of the 4 that this cross has offended have moved to Canada, I think the other 2 need to move there also!!!

  80. Tom on June 20th, 2017 5:09 am

    This is ludicrous, if you don’t like it don’t look at it, if you don’t believe in it, don’t worship it, but don’t take others freedom and rights from them! What’s the world coming to.

  81. Billy on June 20th, 2017 3:03 am

    Pensacola Bay Baptist Association should purchase and maintain this Cross and a designated partial of land it stands on.





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